Well I saw the boat trip as a last test. Paulie kept saying no he didnt spread that rumour (or whatever it was I cant remember) and that helped dim Tony’s fear that Paulie will tell all one day. If he had admitted it, I’m pretty sure it would have been the final nudge towards a watery death, regardless of how long they’ve known each other.
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| Originally Posted by Boomstick I thought it was pretty obvious that he was broken, and I don’t imagine we’ll see much, if anything, of him again. What a great friggin’ character, though. Love 'em. |
Pretty cool of Chase to let that character have one last hurrah before putting him out to pasture. Phil is back in charge (loved the hit on blondie btw) and it looks as though he is going to be rough dealing with from here on out.
Tony appears to be having some serious cash flow problems (borrowing $200,000 from Hesh) and in the next episode it looks like that problem is going to explode and could be the key factor in the undoing of the NJ family.
Maybe so. But I’d have thought it would take Paulie doing something more to get Tony to that point. I mean, it seems Tony already knows it was Paulie anyway, right? I guess we’re supposed to understand that actually hearing Paulie confess would have pushed Tony over the edge. Either way, it felt off to me. Don’t get me wrong, though. This is my favorite show and my first gripe of the season.
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| Originally Posted by cognizant Well I saw the boat trip as a last test. Paulie kept saying no he didnt spread that rumour (or whatever it was I cant remember) and that helped dim Tony’s fear that Paulie will tell all one day. If he had admitted it, I’m pretty sure it would have been the final nudge towards a watery death, regardless of how long they’ve known each other. |
Honestly, it didn’t even occur to me that Tony might kill Paulie if he came clean. What I got from that whole exchange is something that seems to be happening over and over again in these last episodes: Tony feels like he can no longer trust even those that are closest to him. Last week it was Christopher over the Adriana thing, and now it’s Paulie. He gave Paulie a chance to come clean and Paulie lied right to his face. Tony’s always going on about how much he values loyalty, and he doesn’t have much from even his closest allies (except Sil, for now). I don’t think that Tony will die at the end of the show. What I do think is that situations like he just had with Paulie are going to speed up his career burnout and he’s gonna split pretty soon. This really seems to tie in to what a lot of you folks are already discussing about these last episodes: the end of a generation. The end of NJ/NY, the end of the old guard, the end of the loyalty and commitment that it kept to keep those things going.
Another outstanding episode. Chase has commented on more than one occasion that he gets annoyed when people complain the show is boring and not much happens. I think this episode was partially a response to that. First with the Junior thing… the kid going apeshit on him because he was too worn down by life and age to be a tough guy anymore. And then the Tony/Paulie stroyline, which showed that, in a dramatic sense, tension can be a hell of a lot more effective than violence at times. Also with the continued hints that the series could just as easily end with a whimper as a bang.
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| Originally Posted by RyanC Am I wrong in finding it hard to believe that Tony would want to take out Paulie for Ralphie’s death and being an all-around big-mouth? Tony and Paulie have always been mighty tight from what I can remember. Seems that Tony would at least have a come-to-Jesus meeting first with that kind of a friend. |
Tony’s feeling his age and his money’s running out. He’s seen his best friend (Pussy) betray him. He now knows that Paulie is capable of flipping, especially now that he too isn’t earning as much. But even that isn’t the saddest thing to Tony. The saddest thing is how this guy he looked up to is plainly just a moron. Once again Tony feels let down by a parent figure.
I like how the show is dealing with the ravages of time and age. I read somewhere that the real tragedy here is Tony’s failure in therapy. That instead of bettering himself he is determined to drag everyone else down to his own miserable level. In the lake episode, when he brings up that bummer of a story about the kid in the pool, that was something his mother would do. Ruin a nice moment out of pure spite.
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| Originally Posted by RyanC Am I wrong in finding it hard to believe that Tony would want to take out Paulie for Ralphie’s death and being an all-around big-mouth? Tony and Paulie have always been mighty tight from what I can remember. Seems that Tony would at least have a come-to-Jesus meeting first with that kind of a friend. |
I think that’s rather the point, and something Tony himself realizes when he gets up to kill Paulie on the boat. He’s falling apart slowly and starting to get paranoid. In the end, he realizes that this is Paulie that he’s talking about and he’s just looking for reasons to kill him because his fear is consuming him.
Excellent point. This season has done everything to back that up, too. Since the opening scene of the season they’ve been putting Tony out on the edge with close calls–the gun charge and the possible murder link. Then they’ve put doubts about Christopher and Pauly in his mind along with the theme of his fear, or disdain, for getting older.
This is all great stuff.
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| Originally Posted by BobClark Tony’s feeling his age and his money’s running out. He’s seen his best friend (Pussy) betray him. He now knows that Paulie is capable of flipping, especially now that he too isn’t earning as much. But even that isn’t the saddest thing to Tony. The saddest thing is how this guy he looked up to is plainly just a moron. Once again Tony feels let down by a parent figure. I like how the show is dealing with the ravages of time and age. I read somewhere that the real tragedy here is Tony’s failure in therapy. That instead of bettering himself he is determined to drag everyone else down to his own miserable level. In the lake episode, when he brings up that bummer of a story about the kid in the pool, that was something his mother would do. Ruin a nice moment out of pure spite. |
Well, I’m glad that he finally realizes that Paulie is Paulie. But maybe this is all building up to Tony learning that trying to play it safe as a mobster is a losing battle. That his line of work is not worth all of the luxurious payoffs. Then he’ll be forced to do something that he’s never been willing to do in therapy. Take a long, hard look at himself.
Of course, now Paulie is paranoid as all hell too. Maybe to the point of going way overboard to prove something to Tony and himself.
I think my favorite part was Juniors letter to Dick Cheaney. What a great character Junior was and what a perfectly tragic way to end his series story arc, becoming what Tony fears most. To grow old, irrelevent, and forgotten
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| Originally Posted by RyanC Then he’ll be forced to do something that he’s never been willing to do in therapy. Take a long, hard look at himself. |
I think he passed that point long ago. Or at least, perhaps he did see himself and decided there was nothing to be done. Practically speaking, there’s no way they could accomplish such a turnaround in a mere 6 episodes. Plus, he doesn’t think escape from mob life is an option anymore than Joe Business Suit thinks quitting his office job to join the circus is any kind of real option. It’s Tony’s entire identity. Bobby said in the boat, they were still young enough to have a different future ahead. Tony called bullshit on that.
An aside- When Tony was having flashbacks to his first hit, was I the only one having a meta-geek moment in thinking, “I’ll bet that first one was the bitch of the bunch.”?
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| Originally Posted by BobClark An aside- When Tony was having flashbacks to his first hit, was I the only one having a meta-geek moment in thinking, “I’ll bet that first one was the bitch of the bunch.”? |
Haha…definitely. Another superb Gandolfini performance.
I love how they’ve been seamlessly dipping into the past in these first three episodes with flashbacks and stories to flesh things out, and reveal even more about these characters in setting up where they’re all headed.
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| I think my favorite part was Juniors letter to Dick Cheaney. |
I laughed out loud when he said something to the effect of “I too have been involved in an accidental shooting.”
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| Originally Posted by BobClark I think he passed that point long ago. Or at least, perhaps he did see himself and decided there was nothing to be done. Practically speaking, there’s no way they could accomplish such a turnaround in a mere 6 episodes. Plus, he doesn’t think escape from mob life is an option anymore than Joe Business Suit thinks quitting his office job to join the circus is any kind of real option. It’s Tony’s entire identity. Bobby said in the boat, they were still young enough to have a different future ahead. Tony called bullshit on that. An aside- When Tony was having flashbacks to his first hit, was I the only one having a meta-geek moment in thinking, “I’ll bet that first one was the bitch of the bunch.”? |
True, there isn’t time left for them to show Tony leaving everything behind and starting over. But if Tony stays alive and evades prison, I suppose they could end it all by showing him take a new path. Or maybe just going into hiding (witness protection?). And all of this speculation is assuming that Tony and his families will even have some grand closure/resolution by season’s end. But yeah, I guess Tony will remain unyielding to the bitter end.
That might have been Gandolfini’s best work since “Whitecaps”.
They need to make these last 5 perfect. The gambling addiction is WAY tacked on.
I never thought I’d say this, but I actually felt sorry for A.J. tonight.
Man, that last shot was the most evil Tony has looked in a long time.
I don’t know if I’d call it tacked on. A little quick developing, maybe. But I think the compulsive gambling thing goes well with his inability to deal with his own issues. The idea that something else will fix the problem. Going down a road that is increasingly self destructive and paranoid. If he’s not gonna grow, if he’s not gonna die, then maybe by the end of the show Chase will turn us against the guy. Sort of the Jimmy Conway ending. Sad and ignominious.
Tacked on or not it was worth giving Tony this addiction in order to beef up Hesh’s role. Jerry Adler was terrific in this episode.
I have to ask because I was getting dinner, what happened to Hesh’s girl? I know she’s dead but from what?
Secondly, was this the first time a turd was shown on HBO? Mind you I haven’t seen OZ but that was out of nowhere.
Only five eps left!