Originally Posted by Paul McCartneyView Post Ebert said it in his review, but that’s the appeal of TOD. It’s like Indy’s Really Bad Night. It’s what would happen if Indiana Jones was the lead in AFTER HOURS. If anything, I don’t think it takes it far enough. It never quite feels like the ordeal it should. Other TOD shit: * I think Kate Capshaw’s great in the role, and don’t find the character at all annoying, but she looks too much like some permed 80s soccer mum, not the nightclub siren she was clearly scripted as. * The sad face Indy makes in the spike chamber is hilarious, like an outtake they just decided to leave in the film. We… are going… TO DIE… ;_;
That whole spike chamber sequence is great. I especially like the shot where Indy’s fist does the acting: “DO IT NOW!”
I never understood the arguement of Doom being darker than Raiders… just because someone’s looking a heart?
It probably has darker subject matter (the children being captured and worked as slaves), but the tone of the film stays pretty consistant with the other two. How about that comical shot of a rock hitting one of the slave kid’s heads? The stuff with Indy changing over through the Kalima passes by like breeze. The film is rarely serious, just like the others.
I just love how the ending with the bridge you get wide shots showing the river down below is perhaps a shallow creek… but they try to make it seem gargantuan, as well as being 1000 feet below the the bridge itself.
* The sad face Indy makes in the spike chamber is hilarious, like an outtake they just decided to leave in the film. We… are going… TO DIE…
I think I’ve quoted “We…are going…to DIE” more than any other line from any movie I can recall. Although, there was a month straight where whenever my friends or I would see a writing utensil we’d pick it up and say (in our most exaggerated, delirious Denholm Elliot impersonations) “The pen…is mightier, THAN THE SWORD!”
Anyway, I think the Jones movies have the most re-watchability out of any of the trilogies I own. I do have to say that although I hold Raiders in the highest regard out of any of them, I have the most fun with Crusade. Perhaps it’s because it was the one my friends and I re-enacted the most as kids, or maybe some part of me gets giggly over goofy Marcus Brody. I don’t know. Doom was the one that I feared as a youngin’ (I could never stay calm around insects after seeing that and I’m still more than slightly entomophobic) and I would watch the “Raiders face melt” repeatedly as well, but Crusade was the one I would watch from start to finish multiple times in one day. I still pop that one in the most when I’m jonesin’ for some Jones, but I’ve come to recognize Raiders for the masterpiece it is.
The thing which irritates me about Doom, Indy sees a swordman and reaches for his empty gunholster as if he was experienced in shooting swordsmen like that. It’s a throwaway gag to Raiders but it’s another moment of oddness in a film which can barely keep itself together.
Paul absolutely nails it though, it’s like a non-canon Indiana Jones. A wacky standalone adventure, which is removed from the main mythos (Raiders, Crusade and presumably Skull).
See for me, the mythos just expands with TOD - just another Indy adventure but more like a horror film, with a completely different vibe. I adore it tho I’ll be honest (“We are going to DIE” is my favourite Indy line ever) for me Indy is the mythos, regardless of what setting he’s in.
That said Raiders for my money is a near-prefect film.
Originally Posted by Carnotaur3View Post I just love how the ending with the bridge you get wide shots showing the river down below is perhaps a shallow creek… but they try to make it seem gargantuan, as well as being 1000 feet below the the bridge itself.
From what you can see on the DVD, it looks like that bridge was pretty high up - I don’t think it was trick photography (the wide shots).
That moment right after Short Round says “Hang on lady, we go for a ride!” when Indy has a crazy ass look in his eye before he cuts the bridge is probably my favorite moment in the trilogy. Just a great job by the editor in the build up during that scene…
Originally Posted by RathBanduView Post I think it was Dickson who said something to the effect that Doom works on one level as a prequel because it’s about the “fortune and glory” Indy learning the real value of the artifacts he’s hunting for. One of the reasons he has so much contempt for Belloq in Raiders is because in Doom, he basically is Belloq.
Except that the opening to Last Crusade posits that young Indy is already well aware of the historical value of the Cross of Coronado and that it belongs in a museum.
Originally Posted by WayDenView Post From what you can see on the DVD, it looks like that bridge was pretty high up - I don’t think it was trick photography (the wide shots). That moment right after Short Round says “Hang on lady, we go for a ride!” when Indy has a crazy ass look in his eye before he cuts the bridge is probably my favorite moment in the trilogy. Just a great job by the editor in the build up during that scene…
There’s actually alot more iconic stuff in Temple of Doom than there is in all three of the films. That shot of Indy holding the machete over the bridge is just a fucking awesome shot… as well as the tracking shot of Indy in the mines looking on right before he sucker punches one of the Thugs.
Originally Posted by AmphibatronView Post Except that the opening to Last Crusade posits that young Indy is already well aware of the historical value of the Cross of Coronado and that it belongs in a museum.
Originally Posted by RattyView Post That whole spike chamber sequence is great. I especially like the shot where Indy’s fist does the acting: “DO IT NOW!”
I hadn’t thought of that in a long time. I’m no fan of TOD but that scene and Club Obi Wan probably make it worth owning.
Originally Posted by Paul McCartneyView Post * The sad face Indy makes in the spike chamber is hilarious, like an outtake they just decided to leave in the film. We… are going… TO DIE… ;_;
Quite possibly my favorite moment in the entire series with the exception of the iconic “Mola Ram, prepare to meet Khali… in HELL!” scene. Absolutely adore Kamakaze Indy.
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Originally Posted by Spike MarshallView Post The thing which irritates me about Doom, Indy sees a swordman and reaches for his empty gunholster as if he was experienced in shooting swordsmen like that. It’s a throwaway gag to Raiders but it’s another moment of oddness in a film which can barely keep itself together.
I’ve seen this sentiment numerous times on these boards and I still don’t get it. It’s not like he pointedly references the events of Raiders before reaching for his gun. It’s not some “Family Guy”-esque: “Hey, Short Round, this reminds me of the time I…” scene. It’s for the audience alone and, as you said, it’s a throw-away gag. I’ve got no beef with it and probably have laughed each of the dozens of times I’ve watched the movie.
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Originally Posted by AmphibatronView Post Except that the opening to Last Crusade posits that young Indy is already well aware of the historical value of the Cross of Coronado and that it belongs in a museum.
Conversely, young Indy goes through the ordeal of trying to save the Cross only to have it snatched away by the thugs (who have, by the way, the stamp of authority embodied by the Sheriff). I suggest that this would go a long way to making Indy more cynical: a sort of “if our supposed protectors and civil leaders don’t care, why should I?” attitude. And it’s this attitude on display until the climax of Doom.
Originally Posted by MattioliView Post Conversely, young Indy goes through the ordeal of trying to save the Cross only to have it snatched away by the thugs (who have, by the way, the stamp of authority embodied by the Sheriff). I suggest that this would go a long way to making Indy more cynical: a sort of “if our supposed protectors and civil leaders don’t care, why should I?” attitude. And it’s this attitude on display until the climax of Doom.
Also, the obvious daddy issues on display in both the opening to Crusade and peppered throughout the canonical tv series (I think there’s one episode dealing with the result of the death of Indy’s mother, and it’s implied that Indy and his father went years without speaking at one point*) probably didn’t make Indy too keen on living up to the old man’s expectations. You could also make the argument that Indy’s experience from Doom to Raiders is necessary for Crusade – having realized that his father was right, and become in part, the man he thought his father would want him to be, Indy’s able to repair his own relationship with his father in the third film. With that in mind, it’ll be interesting to see how Kingdom plays out the next part of that story: Indy (apparently) having to deal with his own absent fatherhood.
*Maybe it’s because I was exposed to the tv series first rather than the films, but I loved the actor playing Indy’s father in the series much more than Connery.
The biggest “fuck yeah” moment in the series is Indy waking up from the voodoo attacks and punching that thug. It’s my favorite use of the Indy theme in the entire series. Fuck the haters. Temple of Doom is great, certainly better than rehash city Last Crusade.
I don’t think there is a better series of films than Indiana Jones. Each film is fun in their own way, and the fact that we got something that exciting and fantastic on three different occasions (and a fourth on the way) is a pretty amazing achievement.
And really, the heart-ripping sequence isn’t nearly as fucked up as the face-melting in Raiders. It isn’t even the face-melting that really gets me; it’s the face of that spirit changing from angelic to demonic carnie that does it.
The “darkest” moment in DOOM is in the first few minutes, when it’s implied that Indy actually cut off some poor bastard’s fingers in some offscreen fracas as some sort of “punishment”. Casts him in a whole new light.
DOOM is otherwise pretty mild, I find. It’s more shrill and graceless than it is “dark”.
The Indy trilogy is great because each movie has it’s own personality, Temple of Doom is like Raiders’ hyper, obnoxious little brother. Last Crusade is its gentler sentimental dad. I remember the prequel aspect of Temple of Doom being known in the years leading up to its release, then downplayed when it came out. I had marvel comics circa 1982 mentioning “Raiders of the Temple of Death” taking place before. I think it works, Indy is humbled by the experience, he wants the Ark for the museum, not fortune and glory. Yet just look at his rep, Indy is “nefarious” and has “fallen from the pure faith” of archeology. (And in Doom he’s been called a graverobber)
Originally Posted by Paul McCartneyView Post * The sad face Indy makes in the spike chamber is hilarious, like an outtake they just decided to leave in the film. We… are going… TO DIE… ;_;
Originally Posted by Spike MarshallView Post I hadn’t seen the films since Christmas 2003, and I was shocked by how much I still liked them. I was also surprised at the amount of violence on display, it’s kinda ridiculous how bloody and nasty Raiders is, and to be honest some of the scenes in Raiders make the supposedly darker Temple of Doom look like a kids film.
Doomis a kids film … I was 13 when I saw it in the theater and loved it. My younger brother actually shouted “Jump!” during the bridge sequence. He wasn’t playing to the audience, he was just genuinely excited and forgot himself for a moment. I still give him shit for it.
My favorite moment in Doom is when Short Round realizes Indy’s really going to cut the rope bridge. Indiana Jones was explicitly crazy in this film.